Originally posted by Tito Shivan:

Originally posted by Start_Running:

And here's sometyhing people need to remember. Games like FF and MGS3, ARE THE OUTLIERS. They have always been the outliers.

Most likely outcome of a game release is failure. Being another fish in the ocean.
And that's for those who make it to the release line.

People forget the mediocre experiences.

Originally posted by Tito Shivan:

Originally posted by Start_Running:

And here's sometyhing people need to remember. Games like FF and MGS3, ARE THE OUTLIERS. They have always been the outliers.

Most likely outcome of a game release is failure. Being another fish in the ocean.
And that's for those who make it to the release line.

Depends on what you consider a "failure". As someone who has played mostly obscure and unheard of games, many of them are simply... good and they've reached their target audience. There's a very wide area between roaring success and crushing failure.

Originally posted by The nameless Gamer:

Originally posted by Tito Shivan:

Most likely outcome of a game release is failure. Being another fish in the ocean.
And that's for those who make it to the release line.

Depends on what you consider a "failure". As someone who has played mostly obscure and unheard of games, many of them are simply... good and they've reached their target audience. There's a very wide area between roaring success and crushing failure.

Failure as in failed to make a mark on the cultural zeitgeist of the time.

Originally posted by Start_Running:

Originally posted by The nameless Gamer:

The ones swooning over "straight white male" developers are very quick to forget that no "blue-haired land-whales" and "furries" were responsible for Duke Nukem Forever, Dawn of War 3 nor Command & Conquer 4.

and DN4E was a game that ticked all their checkboxes.

Didn't help its sales though.

Originally posted by Start_Running:

Failure as in failed to make a mark on the cultural zeitgeist of the time.

I think many developers are fine with that. After all, extraordinary games are treasured because they're rare, not just because they're very good.

Originally posted by GuerillaTactix:

- The gaming industry feels like a bunch of non-gamers making gaming decisions and hiring non gamers to make games.

They're called executives who hire these things called contractors. Of course you'd know this if you actually knew about the industry

Originally posted by They Live, We Sleep!:

Most strange phenomena can be pinned down to a single date or title, such as the first game to feature a turrent section, or the first game to feature quick-time events (I'm glad those two features are gone). So, what was the first game where the developers had a "activist" mindset, where they didn't care about their customers at all and actively fought against them brazenly. When did this terrible, narcissistic mindset start, and what's the first game to be plagued by it?

I can pinpoint such a mindset with movies, with Ghostbusters 2016. That was the first movie I saw where the director, the actors, and even the studio funding it actively went against the customers and fought against them so openly. It was pretty weird, which made it satisfying when the movie flopped and it sequel was cancelled.

But what about games? What was the first game to be plagued with the "activist" mindset that ruined it?

Activist game dev philosophy really took off around the time of the Zoe Quinn and Anita Sarkeesian nonsense.

Thankfully the pendulum is swinging the other way and game companies are learning that "get woke, go broke" wasn't just a funny catchphrase.

-Christ is King!

Originally posted by Hunter Este:

Originally posted by They Live, We Sleep!:

Most strange phenomena can be pinned down to a single date or title, such as the first game to feature a turrent section, or the first game to feature quick-time events (I'm glad those two features are gone). So, what was the first game where the developers had a "activist" mindset, where they didn't care about their customers at all and actively fought against them brazenly. When did this terrible, narcissistic mindset start, and what's the first game to be plagued by it?

I can pinpoint such a mindset with movies, with Ghostbusters 2016. That was the first movie I saw where the director, the actors, and even the studio funding it actively went against the customers and fought against them so openly. It was pretty weird, which made it satisfying when the movie flopped and it sequel was cancelled.

But what about games? What was the first game to be plagued with the "activist" mindset that ruined it?

Activist game dev philosophy really took off around the time of the Zoe Quinn and Anita Sarkeesian nonsense.

Thankfully the pendulum is swinging the other way and game companies are learning that "get woke, go broke" wasn't just a funny catchphrase.

-Christ is King! :gk_cross:

Execept the phrase gget anti-woke, go broke seems to gold just as true m8.

Originally posted by Hunter Este:

Originally posted by They Live, We Sleep!:

Most strange phenomena can be pinned down to a single date or title, such as the first game to feature a turrent section, or the first game to feature quick-time events (I'm glad those two features are gone). So, what was the first game where the developers had a "activist" mindset, where they didn't care about their customers at all and actively fought against them brazenly. When did this terrible, narcissistic mindset start, and what's the first game to be plagued by it?

I can pinpoint such a mindset with movies, with Ghostbusters 2016. That was the first movie I saw where the director, the actors, and even the studio funding it actively went against the customers and fought against them so openly. It was pretty weird, which made it satisfying when the movie flopped and it sequel was cancelled.

But what about games? What was the first game to be plagued with the "activist" mindset that ruined it?

Activist game dev philosophy really took off around the time of the Zoe Quinn and Anita Sarkeesian nonsense.

Thankfully the pendulum is swinging the other way and game companies are learning that "get woke, go broke" wasn't just a funny catchphrase.

-Christ is King! :gk_cross:

DEUS VULT, my brother.

Originally posted by Reiya:

Originally posted by GuerillaTactix:

- The gaming industry feels like a bunch of non-gamers making gaming decisions and hiring non gamers to make games.

They're called executives who hire these things called contractors. Of course you'd know this if you actually knew about the industry

Ah yes, I'm going to trust that you, random person on the internet, are a wealth of industry insider knowledge. Of course they are contractors. However, Kojima is a gamer, Phil Spencer is a gamer, Iwata was a gamer. Its not unheard of that people who make games or work in the video game industry can also you know... consume products in said industry.

ESG incentivised activism, nothing to do about activism..it's about a new way to shape culture to make money, but larry fink said it failed.... but they are still trying to do activism. Also anti-woke ppl, they are also making money from views from ppl who want to confirm their own views and perspective. QUI BONO...... give you an example my country australia. We have a political side that is popular with the vast majority demographic of ppl, and ppl from other country are making money off these ppl for views and likes and what not lol. There is a product to be sold, not only the producers makes money but also their detractors. Also the under 16 social media ban by my gov is nothing to do with protecting minors, it's about not letting big tech to have the monopoly on said country future consumers. Nothing ever done for good is about for greater good it's about making money. So ppl get out there and make money!

Originally posted by Kiryn:

When did the "activist" game developer mindset start?

When culture war influencers convinced a lot of angry online dudes that anything they didn't like was caused by "activists".

Possibly the best answer in the thread.

Originally posted by Start_Running:

Execept the phrase gget anti-woke, go broke seems to gold just as true m8.

I prefer “Go fash, no cash” myself, but yeah. Also are we really still talking about Anita in the year of 2026?

FFS.

Originally posted by GuerillaTactix:

Originally posted by Reiya:

They're called executives who hire these things called contractors. Of course you'd know this if you actually knew about the industry

Ah yes, I'm going to trust that you, random person on the internet, are a wealth of industry insider knowledge. Of course they are contractors. However, Kojima is a gamer, Phil Spencer is a gamer, Iwata was a gamer. Its not unheard of that people who make games or work in the video game industry can also you know... consume products in said industry.

I've been fighting against the industry practices since the XBOX 360 was brand new. I know more about the industry than some random culture warrior or some random culture war talking head.

Also it not being unheard of isn't the same as it is and has been common for 20 years.

Hironobu Sakaguchi plays Final Fantasy to this day. He did a playthrough of the MSQ of FFXIV to at least the end of Shadowbringers. It was massive news. Yoshi-P plays the game.

Know who doesn't play the game? Takashi Kiryu, the president of Square Enix.

Also Iwata is dead. Phil Spencer retired from Microsoft because he's ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ rich, and Kojima is... the only one who is still honestly active out of all of the people you mentioned. And this is going to piss culture warriors off. The current CEO of XBOX is my age.

I'm 37.

Anti-woke people don't exist, its just the normal masses vs the fanatical left wing minorities.

There is no such thing as Anti woke.

Originally posted by PocketYoda:

Anti-woke people don't exist, its just the normal masses vs the fanatical left wing minorities.

There is no such thing as Anti woke.

What an odd, yet completely incorrect statement to make...

Originally posted by Reiya:

Originally posted by PocketYoda:

Well it seems the ship are righting themselves looking at all the game failures and job losses in the last 2-3 years..

When people ask when is the game industry crash.. We are currently living it.


I assume you'd know why being developer and all, starting a games company is insanely expensive for honestly little to no gain.. No one with a brain would start a game company now as the industry is imploding..

You know all this.

Don't care huh how do you explain all the DEI games failing miserably.. If people don't care why is the masses stopped buying games wholesale.

Ah yes, the only problem in the video game industry is "DEI". That's the only problem. Yep. Only problem.

As if

Corporate greed
The infinite pursuit of infinitely growing profits
Loot boxes
Cut content resold
Pay to win
Live services
Mandatory Online checkins for single player games
Over monetization of games(Looking at you Paradox and Dovetail)
Crunch Culture
Gaming being priced out of being anything other than a niche rich man's hobby
The insistence on targeting what are known as Whales and Krakens
Content being shipped with the game, but you have to buy access to it
Lack of QA Testing
Ship it now, maybe fix it if we're feeling nice mentality
Other launchers being required for games to run
Risk aversion leading to sequel after sequel rather than new IP
Oversaturation of genres(Roguelike, Zombie, Battle Royale, and Soulslike)
The push towards a streaming only future where you still pay full price for the games
Yearly sequels to series that are basically the previous year's game with minor alterations

all somehow don't exist.

So you do agree DEI is one of the problems